Hey, guys. Welcome back to another episode of the Business Journey podcast, I'm Rebecca, and I'm really, really excited about today's episode. We have a good friend of mine, Rob Greene, who is joining us today. And we're just going to dive into tons of really practical stuff all about Flash. So if you didn't know Rob is the flash king, I think I'm the first one that called him the King of Flash. It's got on quickly. Yeah, so I'm going to own that right there. But he is definitely the king of Flash. Any time I've ever had any like flash or lighting questions, he's my go to and I know that several of you guys, if you're behind the lens, y'all have seen him around and so you know him, you love him. So I'm really excited to be able to dive into conversation. Hi, Rob. Welcome.
Rob: Thanks. Glad to be here. Going to be a fun day! .
Rebecca: So fun, So first, in case there's anybody that maybe is not in behind the lens, they're not as familiar with you. Can you tell everybody who you are, what you do, all the things ? Absolutely. So I am a photographer and educator based out of Fort Worth, Texas, and I have over the past couple of years really been trying to help photographers take flash photos that look like natural light photos, because that seems to be the thing everybody's kind of figured out natural light photography thanks to people like you who have created all these amazing educational resources for people to learn that. But there's still so many people going I don't know what to do when I run out of light. I'm in a dark room. I'm, you know, the sun goes down and so I'm like, Well, let me fill in that gap. And so that's really where I've kind of tried to stake my claim is just to go, Hey, the natural light stuff is fun, but the flash stuff can be fun, too. And so I hang out in Fort Worth, Texas, with my dog, Snoopy, and we have a lot of fun taking pictures of TCU grads and shooting weddings.
Rebecca: I love it, and it's so funny because I was a Texas girl. We were like in the same area, and I feel like we didn't even connect until I was right about to move.
Rob: Yeah, I think you bought a camera from me for one of your associates, and we started talking courses when I dropped it off and I'm like, This girl is a wizard. She's amazing.
Rob: I love it. I remember that day we had some friends over. We all eating dinner, and you know, I went outside, obviously to meet you. Grab your camera and I came back, you know, like, forty five minutes later, my husband's like, Are you OK? Fine. I just I met Rob. So we we became like business buddies chatting on things.
Rob: Absolutely I love it.
Rebecca: I love it. Awesome. Well, today we are talking about three reasons Flash. Is it as scary as you think? It's one of those things that I personally, I've been there like I was the person totally afraid of flash I would avoid at all costs. The only time I would pull it out is like if I absolutely had to, you know, Rob, you and I have talked about so many people do that they're like, it stays in the bag until like the very last minute that they have to pull it out. And then they're like, OK, fine, I'll use flash. And at that point, I would just like wing it. I was. I had no idea what I was doing. I would put random settings in there and it was very scary for me. And so thankfully, just from learning so much from you and I've gained confidence in Flash and then I'm able to, you know, we partnered on our behind the lens to be able to teach flash and show flash. And it's it's not as scary. So I'm really excited to dive into this. Before we do, I want to share with everybody about what you and I have going on this week. So surprise you guys. Rob and I are partnering up for a joint class. It's going to be completely free, but it's happening this Thursday and Friday. OK, it's live. So we're going to be on with you guys. You'll be able to chat with us, ask questions. We'll have a Q&A, but we are going to do a joint class where we're teaching about Flash. And when I say we, it's primarily Rob, do you do about Flash. I'll be there because, you know, I love you guys and you know, I can jump in on a few things. But primarily, Rob is going to be teaching on Flash. I just thought that would be a great opportunity to just partner together and provide more flash education for free for you guys because it has been such a big hit. So many people loved his masterclass in behind the lens, the flash master class, and it's just been so good that we wanted to keep the party going. So we're doing this free class. You can sign up today again this Thursday and Friday. You can sign up today at Rebeccaricephoto.com/Flash-Class. All right, Flash-class, and we will link it in the show notes for y'all to register. If you're on social media, you can swipe up and register, but we would love to see you there because it's going to be a big party.
Rob: I'm so stoked. I remember watching all the pictures that people were posting in your Facebook group last time after the masterclass and just go, I man like people like they're connecting the dots, things are clicking, light bulbs are going off, flashbulbs are going off in people's minds. It was great watching what people did with it, so I'm excited to dive in with everybody and see what we can do this time around.
Rebecca: Oh yeah, I remember being so impressed just seeing everybody's like before and after photos when they finally understood Flash. I mean, it was a game changer. So I know anybody that comes if you're, you know, scared of flash or you feel confident, but you want to learn more. I'm telling you, Rob is the guy, so come join our free class. We would love to hang out with you all. There will be a replay available, but you have to register to get the replay, so be sure and do that. OK, let's dive into three reasons Flash is as scary as you think. Rob, I'm going to hand it over to you, Mr. King of Flash, and I'll be kind of jump in periodically, but take it away.
Rob: I love it. Yeah, no. I mean, and I think to start this out, Rebecca, we really just we got to name the elephant in the room, and that's that most of us listening in right now. If we're being really honest, we hate shooting with flash. It is not something that we look forward to. It's kind of like what you were saying earlier, where it's the last resort we go to, if we absolutely have to, but then even we pull it out. It's kind of like we're shooting on a hope and a prayer and hoping things turn out somewhat decent, but we don't really know what we're doing. But I mean, that's just the reality is that for most of us flashes, they're weird. They're scary, you know, to get a good one can be expensive, and we're like, Well, why am I going to invest all this money in something that I hate that doesn't make any sense, like I won't invest money, you know, in things that I love, like lenses that are going to get me all that nice boca and my pictures or, you know, a new mirrorless camera, whatever it may be for us. We want to focus on the things that we love and we're like, I don't like Flash. I don't invest money in that. Or we think maybe I pulled up my menu and I'm like, What am I looking at? This looks like something out of like a 1980s movie looking at the menu on my flash, you know? And then there's that whole idea of like, I can't even see what the picture is going to look like until after I've taken the image. How is that good? You know, we forget that film photographers do that all the time with natural light photos. It's just there's so much that goes into this. And so, you know, the focusing is hard when you're shooting in the dark. Sometimes you get motion blur in your pictures and you don't know why, because you don't get what's going on with all the makeup of the shot. And a lot of times we get the images we're going through. We're like, This doesn't feel like my style. You know, so many people like, you've got this beautifully curated style of what a Rebecca Rice image looks like and so many natural light photographers. We have spent hours and hours crafting our style of what our pictures are going to look like. And then we get a flash image and we're like, I didn't look like the I like, I'm not going to go post that on my Instagram feed like that, and it would look like a totally different person shooting. You know, and so whatever your excuse may be. The reality is, most of us really hate shooting with flash, and it's scary, and we just don't want to think about it. And I get that because Rebecca, I actually I think you and I may have talked about this before where I bought my first flash on my way to a wedding.
Rebecca: Oh, my gosh.
Rob: Do not recommend this for anybody, but I bought my first flash on my way to a wedding and was literally like yelling out questions to the guy at the camera store as I'm leaving the store because I didn't know what to do with the thing. And I literally figured it out on the fly during a wedding reception that people had paid me a lot of money to be at. And I just remembered Rebecca feeling so embarrassed and so like, just guilty that, gosh, these people paid me a lot of money to be here, and I don't know how to shoot part of the day. That's not OK. Like, I need to figure this out. But more than that, I remembered leaving and thinking, I don't want anyone else to ever feel this way. And so as I got more experienced with it and learn how to do things, I was like, Man, I got to help people understand it's not as scary as you think. And here are the three reasons why. Number one is this flash photography. You may not want to go here in your mind right of the gate, but the reality is flash photography is based on all the same concepts as natural light photography. And here's what I mean by that. If you wanted to take a great natural light photo, what are you going to do when you're setting up your shot? You're probably going to start by thinking about things like the composition of the photo. You're going to think about the colors in the photo you're going to think about. You know that there's, you know, soft even light on your subject. You're going to make sure that there's good balance. You know that you've got that nice boca in the background, getting all that blur going on. Those are the things that you're going to think about. And all of that comes into play when you're shooting with Flash, too. And for me, far too often, what I see with photographers is that when they put their flash on their camera, it's like they throw out all the knowledge, all the things that they've been working so hard to learn about natural light photography, and they think they're starting over from ground zero. And the reality is you're not so many components of what goes into making the shot great are things you already know as a natural light photographer, so it doesn't have to be that scary. You have one new variable to factor in, and that's that the light is no longer coming from somewhere up in the sky that you have no control over. It's coming from a little flash on your camera.
Rebecca: Right, I completely relate to that because I remember the first time I really had to use Flash was also at a wedding, which people that know me. I don't shoot weddings, and there's a reason for that. But at the time, I, you know, had to try it out. So I remember having to use flash at a reception, and I, I freaked out like literally exactly what you're saying. As soon as the flash went on my camera, it's like everything went out the door. I'm like, Oh my gosh, I don't know how to shoot. Like, how do I do this? And I was spent the entire night like guessing literally, just like throwing it up there and seeing what? What will work? Oh my gosh, it was so awful and I felt the same way of like I was so embarrassed that people were paying me money and I didn't know how to shoot that. And so I, I feel like that's a really common feeling that people just it's like, we panic. We forget everything that we know, and it's like a whole different world, like stepping into an entirely different photography world, thinking, what in the world do I do like? Yeah, it was. It was pure panic. So yeah, it is comforting to know now that you're right, it is the same concepts. And you know, we don't have to forget that we know how to make a beautiful shot. It's literally like you said, it's adding one little thing, and I don't know why. I just remember thinking that it was just a massive change, that it was changing everything that I did, and that's just not the case. And so if anybody's listening like this should sound comforting to you, it's it's not a massive change. And you know, we'll get into why in the next one, but it's it's OK. Like, we can take a breath, add the flash and then go from there, like with our current knowledge.
Rob: And if you're sitting in that boat that Rebecca and I describe, if you're that photographer right now, today listening who shows up to weddings and is embarrassed that you don't know what to do with Flash, let me just say like, breathe a little bit. It's OK that you're not the only person you don't have to feel like a phony. The whole world's not looking at you going, how do they not know how to shoot with flash? There's a lot of people I have had literally 6000 wedding photographers come to me with this very same question. So it is a issue. It is a struggle point for people across the industry. You're in good company, but it doesn't have to stay that way. That's the great news, right? And so reason number two, that flash is not as scary as you think. Is that flash photography uses all the same exposure settings as natural light photography. So almost every wedding photographer I know, almost every family photographer I know, Rebecca, I'm pretty sure you shoot in manual, correct?
Rebecca: Yes. And I teach my students to shoot manual, too.
Rob: This is like for people that have been in natural light world. This is one of the things we try to pick up quickly because we start realizing, Gosh, when I shoot an auto, it helps like maybe the first day or two that I had my camera. But now that I know the kind of the style I'm aiming for, I know me and I've got to adjust certain settings on my camera to help control and shape what the end product is going to look like. And those three settings that every natural light photographer uses are shutter speed, ISO or ISO and aperture. And if you've got your favorite that you go to, you know, if anybody that's been shooting for a while tends to have that favorite. Whether you're going for shutter speed because, you know, maybe you like a dancing photographer, a sports photographer is probably going to be more likely to use something other than shutter speed first, because shutter speed, they're going to need that to control the motion of the subject. And they know me in faster subjects are going to need higher shutter speeds or if they want more Boca in the background of the shot, they're going to need a lower aperture. These kind of things we just start to know and pick up. As we go through more and more sessions, we start to figure out, OK, when I do this, I like my end product better. All I have to do is dial down my aperture or raise up my shutter speed. And Rebecca, those same settings. I use those any time I need to make a tweak to a flash image like I have a starting point, a I call it my cheat code of settings that I dial in before any flash image that I take. But then from there, if I need to make an adjustment, I know shutter speed, ISO and aperture, all of those are going to impact. Something, for example, like shutter speed controls, how much the background, all the ambient light gets lit or darkened in my image. If I've got a really like dark room with a lot of candle light and I want to bring in that ambience a little more and then I can lower my shutter speed and the subject's not going to get any brighter. The people, the person that I'm lighting with my flash won't get any brighter, but the room will get brighter, which is nice to be able to have that. So all these things, aperture actually only controls what the lighting is on my subject. So anything that's getting lit by flash, I can raise that amount of brightness or lower the amount of brightness on my subject without making the background any brighter, darker, just by raising or lowering my aperture. So all of these settings that I'm using all the time in natural light photography to shape my end product, I use the same things to shape and fine tune my end product with my flash photos as well.
Rebecca: Yeah. So it's basically taking, you know, the ISO, your aperture, your shutter speed, and they have different purposes for flash. But there's there's still the three same settings that you're adjusting. And so whatever you would set, you know, for natural light. We know the purposes for natural light. They just do something a little bit different for Flash. But it's still just three settings. And like I know for me with manual mode, I typically like a set two of my of my three and then leave them, and I'm only adjusting one. And so the same kind of goes with Flash. You can set two for the most part and then just adjust one. So it's like not as complicated as we like to think, because I mean, I tend to like freak out over those things and it's almost like, we think, you know, Oh, I have three settings for my manual mode. Then I have three more settings for for my flash. And now I have six settings, which that's not the case. It's literally the same exact settings.
Rob: I tell people that all the time, Rebecca, I'm like, You, you have so many things you can adjust and you tend to get lost in all the things you could do. But if you can minimize your variables, if you can just really focus on being what's the one or two little things that I need to tweak and keep the rest the same, it's going to make your flash photography experience so much nicer.
Rebecca: Yes, I love that simple simplicity is the best.
Rob: Yes. You know, because most of us are not trying to go out and capture award-winning studio photos of celebrities, you know? So then you probably want to dive a little further into the nuance of all the different settings and all the things you do. Most of us are trying to get soft, even light on our subject and create bright, natural, fun images like we do with natural light. And for that, keep it simple, keep it minimal on the variables, and you're going to have a ton of success.
Rebecca: Yes, it reminds me of like going into a newborn session like in the behind the Lens episode that I did, and it was super dark in there. So I don't need to know, like you were saying, all the nuances of flash to make this beautiful studio, you know, celebrity. It was literally a newborn session. I just needed a brighter house. So that flash, that's what it did it. It did its job. It made it look like it was a super light and airy house. And it wasn't. It was so dark, but it turned out really, really well, and it didn't require, you know, a whole lot. It's all about simplicity, and that made all the difference.
Rob: Amazing. Well, my third and final reason that I believe flash photography is not as scary as you think is that and some of you are going to tell me I'm crazy when I say this, but flash photography gives you more control over the lighting of your images than natural light does. Now, Rebecca, I'm curious, you mentioned you teach natural light photography and you teach shooting and manual to all your students. Why do you teach them to shoot in manual?
Rebecca: Because it gives them way more control over what the image is going to look like in auto? The camera's guessing what the best combination would be and manual you can tell your camera what the best combinations of you know settings are to get the outcome that you want.
Rob: One hundred percent. It's like as photographers, as creatives, we are control freaks if they're being honest. We're control freaks. We want to have maximum control over the outcome of the image. And so shooting and manual, yeah, like you said, it gives us that control that we crave and flash is the same way. You know, I know we've talked a lot about Dave Ramsey. I'm a huge Dave fan. Same. And one of the things he talks about with money is and setting a budget is that budgeting is telling your money where to go instead of wondering where it went. And I actually think that shooting with flash is a lot like that. Flash photography, that flash is taking the place of your sun because when you're doing natural light, you're working off what the Sun is offering and you don't have any control over where that sun goes. And so when it disappears, you're like, Wait, where the sun go right! So flash photography is really telling the Sun where to go instead of wondering where it went. And when you start to see your flash as like, Oh my gosh, I can put the sun anywhere in the sky, anywhere above me to light this image that I want to to get the best possible outcome. It's amazing. I mean, just imagine having that kind of control to put the Sun in the perfect spot in the sky to take the exact kind of photos you love most. You don't have to like duck around a corner and figure out where the shade is, you know? No, I get to take the sun, just pick it right out of the sky, and we're going to know we're going to put it over here, because that would be the best light for this image. That's what you get to do with your flash. And so the moment you stop looking at it as this like unwieldy rabid dog that you're just trying to like, wrestle to the ground without getting bit, you know, and you can start to see it as, Oh, this is my chance to tell the Sun where to go instead of wondering where all my light went. You're going to start to realize the control you have over your finished image is phenomenal. You can actually point your flash towards a wall and simulate what it would look like for the light to be coming in through a window. All of a sudden you could be in a room without any windows, but it looks like there's a window light coming in simply because of where you told the Sun to go. It's amazing what you can do once you realize this. Rebecca: I love that, and I mean that I think is the most freeing concept out of all of them for me, because, like you said, being the control freak. It can be daunting to not know what's going to happen. I remember one session that I didn't have a flash for at the time, and it was an indoor studio session and it was totally fine because we had great natural light in that studio. It was awesome. Well, I had never shot there when it was raining. And so what my very I was doing mini sessions, my very last mini session. All of a sudden it got super cloudy and starts raining. Well, I didn't realize that house is super dark, like because there is such beautiful windows. I never even thought that the house was dark. And so all of a sudden my light disappeared. And let me tell you, I didn't have a flash, so I shot it the best they could. And that was probably the worst session I've ever shot in my entire life because I lost the light and had nothing to do. Like, I didn't even have a flash that I could like, pretend I knew what to do. Like, I was floundering, and that was the scariest moment as a photographer knowing like knowing full well as I was shooting that these images were awful. Like, it wasn't one of those like I loaded on to my computer. It's like I knew the minute that I click the shutter that those photos were awful and like, not even usable. Like, I had to issue a refund to her. We couldn't reshoot it because the studio didn't have availability like it was so bad I had to issue a refund and that that lack of control made a big difference in that moment. That it literally cost me that client because I didn't have control over the light and I didn't have another light source. And so I don't see that to, like, scare anybody. But I it is like, if you're not, you know, if you don't have a flash in your bag, even if you don't know how to use it, like it's time to get a flash in your bag, and then Rob can teach you how to use it. But just knowing that that flash gives you control so that if it starts pouring and you don't have that light that I if I had had a flash, I could say, Oh, no problem. Sun's back, you know, and there's my flash.
Rob: Rebecca. I had a student who booked some coaching with me to some one on one coaching the like really dive into. She went to look through some of her galleries and see, like, What am I doing wrong? There were a lot of tears in the conversation because she I mean, this girl takes the most stunning natural light photos you've ever seen. And like, she's on my short list of like, who's going to be my wedding photographer one day? And she was just not getting the flash images she wanted, and she posted something in our Facebook group the other day that just made me like, grin and tear up all at the same time. She was like, honestly, like the flash part of the day after the Sun went down used to be my least favorite part of the day, and now I look forward to it. It's one of my favorite parts of the day because I just know I can get exactly the results that I want. No matter the circumstance, I'm going to be able to get the outcome and it's going to be so easy. I'm not having to like duck around corners and figure out what's the Sun doing. I just get to make it up, and I know my results are going to be consistent throughout.
Rebecca: Amazing. That's that's the goal is to be so excited about flash and just so confident knowing that you, you have the control and you can make it look however you want. And I think you're right that that that is a great reason that flash doesn't have to be scary because if anything, that I mean, it puts you in the driver's seat to say, this is what I want my images to look like, and here's how we're going to make it happen. And so that I know for me, those things are very helpful to know that Flash is not as scary as it. Has to be or, as you know, as people make it out to be, and that there's just so much benefit in having that knowledge in your pocket because I think it's one of those things that people don't really necessarily want to learn about Flash. It's it's a necessity. They have to learn Flash just because if you ever get put in a situation, you have to know how to use it. And so photographers listening, guys, I'm telling you this is one of those things. Yes, it can be scary. OK, I'm not discounting that. It can be scary. But what our goal here is to say that it doesn't have to be as scary as you think it is. And so if you haven't purchased a flash, I challenge you. Go buy a flash. Rob said. In our master class, our flash master class, even if it's a cheap flash from Walmart, like get something in your bag and then you can upgrade later, like once you learn it, but you need to start learning it just because if you are going to pursue this, you know, photography business thing, it's one of those things you just have to know. Right? Just like kind of like shooting a manual mode if you're going to be a professional photographer. I know I don't know any professionals that she didn't auto mode not to say they aren't there, but the majority of professional photographers shoot in manual mode. It's just one of those things. Can it be scary? Yeah, but it's one of those things that you just have to take the time to learn because that knowledge is irreplaceable, right? It could be the difference between an amazing session and losing a client, to be honest, if we're going to like, go there.
Rob: So it's really it's the difference between reacting to every scenario you're in and creating an art piece. That's your desired result.
Rebecca: Yes, exactly. That's so well put. We don't want to, you know, get stuck in this cycle of reactionary photography that we want to get to the place that you're creating because you are the artist. And this is what we do is we create beautiful images. So Rob, I know this has been super helpful. I am super excited for everybody else to be listening to you. Thank you for sharing all this. Before we close. Can you give everybody? Let us know where they can find you. Where they can connect with you. All the things.
Rob: Yes. So we are on Instagram, Twitter, Facebook, Pinterest, YouTube just got the YouTube channel up and roll on a couple of months ago, and it's @Square8studio across all these things. So square like the Shape 8's The No. Studio Singular not announced at the end when a studio. Awesome. Yeah, go find Rob. Give him a follow. He's been doing such a great job with his YouTube to go binge. Watch all his YouTube videos, and then don't forget to join us for our class this week. We are doing one on Thursday or sorry, one on Wednesday and one on Thursday, and so they will be the same class. You don't have to come to both, but come to one, so you can register today at RebeccaRicePhoto.com.flash-class and we'd love to see you there live. We will have a Q&A. So if you want to ask any questions for me or for Rob.
Rob: Bring em!
Rebecca: Then you know, come join us. We like love questions. We I know we both do. We thrive in Q&A, so I'm super excited. I can't wait.
Rob: Amazing. Well, thank you so much for having me on. I'm looking forward to this. Later this week. We're gonna have a blast.
Rebecca: Yes. going to be awesome. All right, you guys, we're going to close out for today. Thanks so much for tuning in and we'll see you this time next week. Bye.
Episode Transcript
